It's only logical that they change the venue from year to year to make the trip eaiser for groups in different areas and keep things fresh. But more than that, most groups want to go to different places and experience new things and the only way you're going to end up with the kind of competition they had in Chicago this year is to continue to get as many of those big groups to attend the same event as possible. You stand to gain better attendance by repeat groups if you don't keep your "biggest" contest in the same place each year. That's why I think the "cup" in Branson has not emerged as the "definitive" event to attend; besides the fact that Missouri is less glamorous a desination than some of their other offerings, the champions are not very likely to return to defend their title unless they live close to the venue and are willing to make the same trip repeatedly.
FAME would probably do well to change their naming scheme and declare a different competition location as their "cup" each year, which would make it easier for choirs to decide which event is likely going to have the biggest turnout/most competition. It seems like that's what they're starting to do here by announcing FAME NYC as "the one to be at" in 2009, though it doesn't carry the "cup" title. While they still won't get ALL of the biggest names to come (as Mr. Temple has pointed out, it's not unheard of for some choreographers to take on multiple groups and having those groups compete against each other may be construed as a conflict of interest), such a strategy would probably result in the closest thing to a regular "national competition" that we can hope for.
Yeah i know
I was just you know....hoping that they would do it the same place two years in a row but... guess not
It's only logical that they change the venue from year to year to make the trip eaiser for groups in different areas and keep things fresh. But more than that, most groups want to go to different places and experience new things and the only way you're going to end up with the kind of competition they had in Chicago this year is to continue to get as many of those big groups to attend the same event as possible. You stand to gain better attendance by repeat groups if you don't keep your "biggest" contest in the same place each year. That's why I think the "cup" in Branson has not emerged as the "definitive" event to attend; besides the fact that Missouri is less glamorous a desination than some of their other offerings, the champions are not very likely to return to defend their title unless they live close to the venue and are willing to make the same trip repeatedly.
FAME would probably do well to change their naming scheme and declare a different competition location as their "cup" each year, which would make it easier for choirs to decide which event is likely going to have the biggest turnout/most competition. It seems like that's what they're starting to do here by announcing FAME NYC as "the one to be at" in 2009, though it doesn't carry the "cup" title. While they still won't get ALL of the biggest names to come (as Mr. Temple has pointed out, it's not unheard of for some choreographers to take on multiple groups and having those groups compete against each other may be construed as a conflict of interest), such a strategy would probably result in the closest thing to a regular "national competition" that we can hope for.
It's only logical that they change the venue from year to year to make the trip eaiser for groups in different areas and keep things fresh. But more than that, most groups want to go to different places and experience new things and the only way you're going to end up with the kind of competition they had in Chicago this year is to continue to get as many of those big groups to attend the same event as possible. You stand to gain better attendance by repeat groups if you don't keep your "biggest" contest in the same place each year. That's why I think the "cup" in Branson has not emerged as the "definitive" event to attend; besides the fact that Missouri is less glamorous a desination than some of their other offerings, the champions are not very likely to return to defend their title unless they live close to the venue and are willing to make the same trip repeatedly.
FAME would probably do well to change their naming scheme and declare a different competition location as their "cup" each year, which would make it easier for choirs to decide which event is likely going to have the biggest turnout/most competition. It seems like that's what they're starting to do here by announcing FAME NYC as "the one to be at" in 2009, though it doesn't carry the "cup" title. While they still won't get ALL of the biggest names to come (as Mr. Temple has pointed out, it's not unheard of for some choreographers to take on multiple groups and having those groups compete against each other may be construed as a conflict of interest), such a strategy would probably result in the closest thing to a regular "national competition" that we can hope for.
Haakon, either you already know something you're not supposed to - OR - great minds think alike!! I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume it's the latter. ;)
Indeed FAME has long debated making the SHOW CHOIR CUP an event that rotates from destination city to destination city year after year. We had high hopes of moving the CUP last year but waited to late to make the announcement and too many groups had already signed up for the event. I think in the days to come you might just here an "official" announcement that the SHOW CHOIR CUP will head...oh lets say...northeast this year!
Now again, I'm gonna assume you haven't been talking to all the "worker bees" behind the scenes to get insider tips (after all we ALL know what happened to poor old Martha) but I'm glad to see that it seems as though our instincts were right, and that this move will come as something that the industry is ready for/willing to embrace. Our goal is to provide the industry with top-notch line-ups in world-class destination cities. Our hope is that that moving the CUP this year will only strengthen that commitment. Stay tuned....
I don't want to revive a dead subject, and don't take this as an offense. Also, I am only a sophmore in high school, so others opinions and experiences with different venues and auditoriums might be more experienced. I just thought that I'd put my two cents in. ;)
Out of about 10 competitions I have ever been to (competing), I have to say that the easiest to set up in was either Piqua High School in Ohio (I think), or the TriLakes Center in Branson, Missouri. Both of the backstage areas and setup areas were very well-designed, in my opinion.
As to auditoriums, the two places I mentioned above are my personal favorite. At Piqua, I thought that the auditorium was not too small, but not too big that the sound from the stage was distorted. At Branson, I can imagine that with large amount of groups that attend in some years (2005 maybe), the TriLakes Center is definitely large enough to accomodate every group comfortably. Like I said about the sound being distorted with a very large auditorium, I don't know what the designers of the Center did, but that is definitely not the case with the TriLakes Center.
Also, another thing that I have noticed at different auditoriums is the placement of the judges. I am not talking about the location of the judges like whether they are in the front, middle, or back of the auditorium. I think that auditoriums that place the judges in the back of the auditorium on preferrably the ground floor are perfect. From my limited experience, I think only a couple of competitions had the judges on a balcony or something like that.
Like I said above, I just thought I'd put my two cents in, and I hope my knowledge and experience with different venues, stages, auditoriums, and judge placing will increase. I hope everyone had a great season, and I can't wait for next year to arrive. ;)
Actually i thought the sound from the trilakes Center was very dead. Everything sounded great from the seats but on stage it was really difficult to hear what the person next to you was singing... That is probably why the barbershop sounded great at that comp... But i didn't feel it was our best show because it was really difficult to keep everything together. Not only FC had problems in 2005, but it seemed like a few other groups were having a hard time hearing their bands or vice versa. Anyway, still an awesome competition i just didn't think the venue was all that...
I don't want to revive a dead subject, and don't take this as an offense. Also, I am only a sophmore in high school, so others opinions and experiences with different venues and auditoriums might be more experienced. I just thought that I'd put my two cents in. ;)
Out of about 10 competitions I have ever been to (competing), I have to say that the easiest to set up in was either Piqua High School in Ohio (I think), or the TriLakes Center in Branson, Missouri. Both of the backstage areas and setup areas were very well-designed, in my opinion.
As to auditoriums, the two places I mentioned above are my personal favorite. At Piqua, I thought that the auditorium was not too small, but not too big that the sound from the stage was distorted. At Branson, I can imagine that with large amount of groups that attend in some years (2005 maybe), the TriLakes Center is definitely large enough to accomodate every group comfortably. Like I said about the sound being distorted with a very large auditorium, I don't know what the designers of the Center did, but that is definitely not the case with the TriLakes Center.
Also, another thing that I have noticed at different auditoriums is the placement of the judges. I am not talking about the location of the judges like whether they are in the front, middle, or back of the auditorium. I think that auditoriums that place the judges in the back of the auditorium on preferrably the ground floor are perfect. From my limited experience, I think only a couple of competitions had the judges on a balcony or something like that.
Like I said above, I just thought I'd put my two cents in, and I hope my knowledge and experience with different venues, stages, auditoriums, and judge placing will increase. I hope everyone had a great season, and I can't wait for next year to arrive. ;)
I think that we should all just keep on commenting, whether the certain directors don't like the website or they do.
And by the way the "Jorges" "anas" and "lightmycandles" of the world, happen to be very intelligent and know what they're talking about. I've only talked to Adam outside of SCC, but I have talked to ana once on here, and she is just the nicest person. I have also talked to Andy, and he seems like a really..... enthusiastic person ;)
It's not just the alumni either. I get a LOT of greif from my own choir because I post on here. I'm often told to "stop posting on here" by some of my own choir mates. I just think that if people have a problem with this website, then they should just keep it to themselves.
I was actually going to try to go to fame Chiago in 2009 hoping it would be the big event again!!!
It's only logical that they change the venue from year to year to make the trip eaiser for groups in different areas and keep things fresh. But more than that, most groups want to go to different places and experience new things and the only way you're going to end up with the kind of competition they had in Chicago this year is to continue to get as many of those big groups to attend the same event as possible. You stand to gain better attendance by repeat groups if you don't keep your "biggest" contest in the same place each year. That's why I think the "cup" in Branson has not emerged as the "definitive" event to attend; besides the fact that Missouri is less glamorous a desination than some of their other offerings, the champions are not very likely to return to defend their title unless they live close to the venue and are willing to make the same trip repeatedly.
FAME would probably do well to change their naming scheme and declare a different competition location as their "cup" each year, which would make it easier for choirs to decide which event is likely going to have the biggest turnout/most competition. It seems like that's what they're starting to do here by announcing FAME NYC as "the one to be at" in 2009, though it doesn't carry the "cup" title. While they still won't get ALL of the biggest names to come (as Mr. Temple has pointed out, it's not unheard of for some choreographers to take on multiple groups and having those groups compete against each other may be construed as a conflict of interest), such a strategy would probably result in the closest thing to a regular "national competition" that we can hope for.
I love how it's been pretty much a month since this competition and people are still constantly reading and posting in this thread. it's amazing. >.<
I just thought I should point that out.
you can now continue your converstation
I still wish I was able to be at FAME Chicago 2008.
Including myself as one of the friends "Jorge" has amassed in his SCC exploits, I find it my responsibility and my pleasure to aid in his rebuttal.
Simply put, the condescension in Sparky1's post is largely unwarranted. Adam is correct in stating that he has never credited himself as being an expert, and I don't recall Ana or Chris ever tossing around such words either. I don't know lghtmycandle16 outside of this website and I would be uncomfortable commenting on him, but in all other cases Sparky1's post is off base.
As for the general sentiment that alumni posters are overly present, too critical and very confident in their views, I do understand this thinking and at one point believed similarly. Before I graduated from high school and my role as a competing singer/dancer, I thought it was strange that people not currently involved in competitive programs would visit SCC. It was only after I joined the collegiate ranks and was able to look at show choir through the lens of an unbiased spectator that I understood the complete value of feedback from a variety of sources. As Haakon has inferred, every voice is important. The more people that contribute to the discussion of all topics show choir, the greater diversity of opinions we can appreciate and the better consensus that can be reached. SCC has been created and maintained as a community website, and the show choir community is one that is rich with involved and supportive alumni.
Finally, and as a point of personal opinion (seeing as my ego is as yet unsatisfied with this post), I think it's a shame that there are many directors and other show choir professionals that do not more openly express their thoughts on this website. I do see how someone could believe that contributions here may effect how a group is judged in competition, but there are larger issues at stake in the realm of show choir and music education than which group receives the bigger hunk of plastic on any given weekend. Without the input of those that are most directly responsible for creating what is put on stage by groups across the country, it's no wonder that directors are making light of topics and posters that can only discuss matters on am unnecessarily shallow level. In order to effect change and better what can be accomplished in the choral classroom, it is necessary to hear those that are transforming the notes on a page into something much more alive. Perhaps some believe this website is not the medium for accomplishing such goals, but is this not the single most recognized and utilized show choir portal?
Whenever I am approached about showchoir.com and told that some directors/parents/judges/whoever don't like it because of posts in the forums that they deem "controversial," I kindly remind them that it is the users themselves who create and perpetuate the content on the discussion boards. If you don't like a topic, it is in your best interest to participate and bring your opinion to the table so that your perspective is heard. To simply silence yourself or read from the shadows removes your voice from the discussion and, in return, suppresses your outlook. It's kind of like politics... if you don't vote, you don't really have room to complain about who's in office. As long as the discussion stays clean and free of personal attacks, I do not censor posts. It is my belief that the more people who are active on the website, the more productive and supportive it can be; if one viewpoint is unrealistic or unfair, it is likely that it will be challenged and/or discussed until a reasonable consensus is reached.
As for the "Show Choir Nationals" competition in Nashville, I had the privilege of attending this year and I had an absolutely wonderful time. The venue is great, the hosts were wonderful, and the judging was fair. I don't agree with Adam that I prefer morning finals... asking a group to have to give their big performance of the year at 8am is pretty unreasonable I think, although I understand the reasoning is that the Opera house must be vacated by the early afternoon so it can be used later in the evening for regular shows. If this limitation did not exist, I can't imagine that the organizers would set up the competition this way.
With that in mind, I also attended FAME Chicago and enjoyed it just as much - if not more - because the level of competition was higher. I think as these kinds of events are more publicly discussed and highlighted on a national level, the groups in attendance are going to have a major impact on the success of the competition from a publicity point of view. FAME is extremely smart in declaring New York as their "big" event for 2009; although it will probably be a little while before a final, definitive list of groups is posted, I can already predict that it is likely to spawn the next thousand-post topic on SCC. That is, as long as individuals don't flock to the shadows and stop posting because they're afraid of what their directors might think. " border="0" alt="laugh.gif" />
I love how all the alumni (myslef included from time to time) are the ones on here WAAAAAY to much, with far too many "expert" opinions and somehow have the biggest egos, loudest opinions, and harshest criticisms. Perhaps part of growing up is not just getting older, but moreover getting WISER. I learned recently that most of the professionals in the industry simply laugh and joke about all the Jorges, johnsalosers, anas, lightmycandles, and Sparkys of the showchoir.com world. I was totally humbled when I overheard two directors who I respect condeming the arrogant and foolish posts by not only myself, but many of the others on here who seem to spend way to much time and effort making sure their prescence and opinion on this site is noted in nerely EVERY category. I for one learned my lesson and will from now on mostly READ this site. I would hate for my abilities and talents to be black balled just because of stupid posts on showchoir.com Maybe several others on here should follow my lead..... " border="0" alt="ermm.gif" />
Hmmm… where to begin?
First off, I have never said at any time that I was / am an "expert". I have never said that my opinion is somehow better or higher than anyone else on this board. I do share my thoughts and opinions often and do understand that not everyone agrees with it.
As for your claim that you have encountered "professionals in the industry" who laugh and joke about certain posters and the content of their posts… you'll always have that, I guess. I don't know if this was a post to scare us into being quiet or something, but quite honestly, I don't really care what your "professionals" think. I have met some of my best friends from this website. Our relationships have moved past the "virtual world" of showchoir.com and internet chats into wonderful friendships that have only grown from our shared passion. Show choir was simply the foundation that expanded our relationships into all facets of our lives in the real world.
Not only have I made great friendships with certain individuals on this site, it has also given me the opportunity to meet, chat, and share with superior directors, choreographers, arrangers, and professionals throughout the country. Thankfully… the directors and other professionals that do associate with all of us "foolish" and "arrogant" SCC posters are the people that actually are kind and who care about the art that is show choir.
As for "abilities and talents" being "black balled just because of stupid posts on showchoir.com"… is false. Out of the posters listed, Ana and I both work with established show choirs, and that statement couldn't be further from the truth. Because, simply… our posts aren't stupid. Ana's posts are some of the most intelligent posts you can find on this website. You may disagree, but I'm sure there will be plenty of posts after mine agreeing. My posts usually are bold and share my opinions, sometimes opinions other people are afraid to say. After working with our respective show choirs, I feel that I can speak on both Ana and I's behalf in saying that this website has not hurt our reputations, abilities, and talents… but it has only magnified them. Through the ideas and opinions shared and the great people that this website has brought together our future is bright and I fear no "Black Balling".
There will always be haters in this world. I wouldn't expect anything less. I've dealt with my fair share of them virtually and in person. I've walked into a cafeteria full of show choir fans and professionals and have seen the jabbing stares and hear the suspicious whispers, but instead of fretting, it simply makes me laugh (or LOL, if you will). But sometimes, you've just got to say, "To hell with them." Until the day that I am not let into a competition for being "Jorge", I think I'll keep posting. Thanks for the advice though, Alex.
Back to the other off topic at hand that I MUST make my presence known in- Nashville truly is a fantastic competition and finals in the morning gets the blood going.
I love how all the alumni (myslef included from time to time) are the ones on here WAAAAAY to much, with far too many "expert" opinions and somehow have the biggest egos, loudest opinions, and harshest criticisms. Perhaps part of growing up is not just getting older, but moreover getting WISER. I learned recently that most of the professionals in the industry simply laugh and joke about all the Jorges, johnsalosers, anas, lightmycandles, and Sparkys of the showchoir.com world. I was totally humbled when I overheard two directors who I respect condeming the arrogant and foolish posts by not only myself, but many of the others on here who seem to spend way to much time and effort making sure their prescence and opinion on this site is noted in nerely EVERY category. I for one learned my lesson and will from now on mostly READ this site. I would hate for my abilities and talents to be black balled just because of stupid posts on showchoir.com Maybe several others on here should follow my lead..... " border="0" alt="ermm.gif" />
FAME Chicago 2008
" border="0" alt="laugh.gif" /> I will take this as a compliment. 
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